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Dáil Éireann - Volume 352 - 10 October, 1984 Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Constitutional Change. Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa 1846 [1846] 3. Proinsias De Rossa asked the Taoiseach if he will proceed with the Constitutional Crusade he promised when he was previously Taoiseach now that the New Ireland Forum has produced its report and if he will make a statement on the matter. The Taoiseach Garret FitzGerald The Taoiseach: It would I think be wrong to raise constitutional issues at the present moment which could give rise to controversy and could make it more difficult to obtain an agreed approach to whatever considered reaction the British Government may make to the report of the New Ireland Forum. Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa: When I put this question to the Taoiseach in November last he indicated that he would not be willing to answer it until the Forum had concluded its business and reported. It has now reported and the Taoiseach says he does not want to say anything about it—— An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: Has the Deputy a question? Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa: ——until such time as the British Government have responded. The Taoiseach is on record as saying that there is a need for constitutional change in this State, irrespective of the outcome of any negotiated settlement or otherwise in Northern Ireland. He said specifically that the tragedy in Northern Ireland should not be used as a political calculation in relation to our Constitution. Would he indicate if he feels that constitutional change is required to Articles 2, 3, 41 and 42 now, irrespective of whether there is agreement with Britain or with the Unionists in the North? The Taoiseach Garret FitzGerald 1847 The Taoiseach: My views on the need for certain constitutional changes are well known, but I have no intention of pursuing them at this time in a manner that could in any way make it difficult for the Forum initiative to yield fruitful results. That process of reform and the establishment of a joint report by the four nationalist parties for transmission to the [1847] British Government, and seeking a response to that report by the British Government, is still in being and we are awaiting a considered response from the British Government. In my view it would be inappropriate and very wrong of me to do anything that might prejudice the favourable outcome of that whole process by pursuing a matter in which I have a very strong personal interest and concern. Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey: In view of a number of statements the Taoiseach made about a response by the British Government to the Forum report, is it his view that this matter is now entirely one for the Government or does the all-party process which took place during the Forum deliberations, and subsequently in the preparation of its report, have any further bearing on the matter? An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: That seems to be a very different question. Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey: Would you say so? An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: I would. Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey: I do not think you are right. The Taoiseach might be inclined to answer it nevertheless, because it is topical and important. An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: The Chair recognises this as a different question. Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey: I am the most orderly person in this House—— An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: I would not quarrel with the Deputy on that. Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey: ——but I think this is very relevant to the whole matter of constitutional change and the response of the British Government which the Taoiseach mentioned. An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: But it does not arise on this question. Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey 1848 [1848] Mr. Haughey: In response to Deputy De Rossa the Taoiseach mentioned a response from the British Government. Arising out of that reply, I am asking him if he envisages any role for the parties who participated in the Forum, or is it his view that this matter is now entirely within the province of the Government exclusively? An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: The Chair must rule that that is separate and distinct from—— Mr. G. Collins Mr. G. Collins Mr. G. Collins: Even having regard to the Taoiseach's supplementary answer? An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: No, the supplementary answer dealt with something in the Forum but that does not open this question to a full debate on the Forum. Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey Mr. Haughey: We are talking about the response of the British Government. Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa: In his reply the Taoiseach said it was his personal opinion that changes were required to the Constitution but when speaking to the Seanad in 1981 he was speaking as Taoiseach, and again he is speaking as Taoiseach here today. He said in 1981 that regardless of the attractiveness or otherwise of our ideas to the Unionist community—— An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy must confine himself to a question. Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa: I am asking a question relating to the constitutional crusade. An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy was making a speech. Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa: I am not making a speech. I have to explain exactly what the question involves. An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: That could take a very long time and would reduce Question Time to a farce. Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa 1849 [1849] Proinsias De Rossa: It would take a lot less time if I was allowed to continue. The Taoiseach said in the Seanad in 1981 that it was a fallacy to say that we must wait until the Unionist population are prepared to accept a package—— An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy is not allowed to qoute. Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa: I am not quoting, I am referring to a speech made. An Ceann Comhairle Thomas J. (Cavan) Fitzpatrick An Ceann Comhairle: I will allow the Deputy to ask a question—— Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa: I am asking a question. Has the Taoiseach now changed his mind? Are we no longer in a position to change our Constitution and must we wait until such time as the British Government and the Unionists in Northern Ireland agree to a package before we can proceed to change the Constitution in the way in which the Dáil and the people of this State want it changed? The Taoiseach Garret FitzGerald The Taoiseach: I have answered the question very clearly. I have not changed my mind on either of those points. At present we are awaiting a considered reaction from the British Government to the report of the New Ireland Forum. I would not wish, therefore, to raise constitutional issues in a way which could give rise to controversy and could make it more difficult to obtain an agreed approach to whatever that reaction might be. Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa Proinsias De Rossa: At what point does the Taoiseach feel that the Dáil and the people of this State can safely discuss changes in the Constitution? Is it next week, next month or next year? The Taoiseach Garret FitzGerald 1850 The Taoiseach: When the process initiated by the Forum has been brought to completion, the question could then arise. However, I have made it clear that [1850] I do not intend to raise issues of this kind at present which could make it more difficult to secure an agreed reaction to whatever response might come from the British Government. Dáil Éireann 352 Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. Constitutional Change. Questions 19841010
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